Curse

GloryFox · Aug 28, 2006, 11:13 PM // 23:13

Quote:

posted by TheMosesPHD
If anyone can find the direct quotes from ANet on these official things, it'd be helpful. I know they're official but I can't find the direct quote, and Glory Fox keeps wanting an official statement on the 300 new skills and a bunch of other stuff.

If we could at least get a quote on the 300 new skills then I don't see what other evidence we'd need to prove that there will be no new rit/sin skills in Nightfall.

300 new skills:
75 Paragon + 75 Dervish + 25(6) Core class skills = 300 skills all accounted for.

There's no room for any new rit or sin skills. How is this not enough to prove there will be no new rit/sin skills in Nightfall?

Thank you for asking. That is referenced from this thread

http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...php?t=10010335

and this link from within the thread

http://www.ebgames.com/product.asp?c...ct%5Fid=646706

at the point the ANET responded in that same thread.

Quote:

posted by Gaile Grey
Hey, there,

I need to share something I just posted in another forum, because I think it's really relevant here, too.

I was reading the forums this evening and started to get that déjà vu feeling. Back in 2004, when we announced Guild Wars Prophecies, we saw a lot of retailers pick up on the news and post about the game on their sites. That was good – we appreciated them getting the word out that our game was coming, and they, of course, profited from sharing the info by lining up sales of the preorder and the game.

However, there were some problems with what they posted: Some of it just wasn't factual. For instance, how many veterans remember the "cloth map" that was allegedly going to be part of the Prophecies Collector's Edition? Or how about the supposed "Special Edition" that at least one retailer offered, with a contents list like the CE contents but a price that was $20 lower? Does anyone remember about 412 "release dates," too?

The problem with all these things is: The information did not come from ArenaNet. The information was wrong.

We love to share information. We're excited about Nightfall and can't wait to tell you about it: facts, figures, dates, the whole nine yards! So if we had things nailed down, we would announce details from the rooftops! But things are not locked down yet and neither the box contents nor the game content is finalized. Therefore, we're not making any announcements.

Bottom line: Wait to hear it from ArenaNet. We'll give you the straight info, and as soon as we can.

So far the rundown from EBgames posts on thier website:
• Customizable Heroes (party NPCs) that level up with the player, follow player instructions in combat, and use armor, weapons, and skills of the player’s choice.
Verified by Alex Weekes on the Developers thread.

• A new game type, Hero vs. Hero Battles will allow a single player to participate in PvP with hero NPCs.
Verified by Alex Weekes and the GW website

• Two new professions: The Dervish, a scythe-wielding holy warrior and The Paragon, the guardian angels of the Elonian people.
Verified by the PvP weekend event and GW website

• 4 new guild halls.
Unverified

• 300 new skills.
Unverified

• 250 Quests, 55 explorable areas, 20 new Story Missions, and three new Challenge Missions.
Unverified

• Peerless online RPG action with no monthly fees!
Totally Verified

TheMosesPHD · Aug 28, 2006, 11:49 PM // 23:49

And now just recently we've recieved confirmation on the Hero vs. Hero battles that ebgames had spilled the beans about way too early. Gaile came on to try and cause confusion because they didn't want that info released yet.

The fact that ebgames gave a very specific list of features that will be included in Nightfall, and that one of them was recently confirmed by ANet, and the way Gaile tried to cover it up with her vague denials, all give rise to implying that the information prematurely presented is quite true.

Quote:

Originally Posted by Gaile Gray

The information did not come from ArenaNet. The information was wrong.

Yet the information about the Hero vs. Hero feature was not wrong. It was right on the ball. Gaile is a PR representative. Her job is to make the customers feel good and get excited about new features/games, not provide reliable information to the customers. She often makes statements herself that are completely wrong or miscontrued.
A quote from Gaile can never be trusted as fact, or used in any way to support or discredit any claims made by anyone, no matter how bogus those claims may be. But everyone should know this already. Sadly I guess you don't.

Also we can consider the fact that Factions, being similar to Nightfall in that they both brought 2 new professions, brought forth 300 new skills, following the (75(2) + 25(6)) structure.

Also there is the fact that Nightfall is a standalone game. It's structure does not interact with, and does not influence or become influenced by the state of it's two predecessors. The only exception would be the prices of the raw materials (crafting, runes and the like) that are common between all games. With this in mind, making skills available to classes unavailable to those who own Nightfall exclusively, doesn't seem to make much sense to me.

You're right. None of the above is concrete 100% proof that there will be no new skills in Nightfall. Yet, there is quite a lot of evidence to raise doubt that new rit/sin skills are the slightest bit likely.

EDIT: and I see you changed your post to show that 3 of the 6 features described by the EBgames report have been verified, yet this still doesn't seem to raise any assurance that the other three are probably correct as well?

Ninna · Aug 28, 2006, 11:55 PM // 23:55

20 new story missions - Verified by GW Press Release
http://www.guildwars.com/press/relea...2006-08-24.php

Quote:

epic story that spans twenty missions

Nightfall as a Stand alone game - Verified by Keith Quinn of NCSoft
http://www.gwonline.net/wiki/index.php/ComicCon_2006

Quote:

Anyone who buys Nightfall gets a full version of the game .. Guild Wars: Nightfall is a complete package. If someone comes to GW as a new player by purchasing Nightfall, he has no need to ever buy the prior two Guild Wars episodes. If a player ever wishes to buy the older episodes he is certainly able to do so, and he’ll then have access to the old continents, old items, and old zones. Or he can simply play the latest campaign, waiting for new expansions. Either way, he’s got everything he needs to enjoy a full virtual life in the Guild Wars universe.

GloryFox · Aug 29, 2006, 12:10 AM // 00:10

Quote:

20 new story missions Verified
http://www.guildwars.com/press/relea...2006-08-24.php

Yes but not the whole line that’s why I did not say verified but yes the 20 missions was verified and I should have posted it on my above post. The 250 Quests and three Challenge missions has not been fully verified.

However this thread is more about skills, and the future of FLAVOR Classes then number of missions required to complete NightFall. THAT has not been verified.

I remember when a product list was sent out by the Marketing Dept early one day. Only to find out that 2 of the 20 products was changed before we were supposed to send out the final list. Sometimes Marketing Departments jumps the gun and I assume that is what happened with EBGames.

Quote:

None of the above is concrete 100% proof that there will be no new skills in Nightfall. Yet, there is quite a lot of evidence to raise doubt that new rit/sin skills are the slightest bit likely.

I totally agree however doubt does not mean fact. My arguments stem from people using opinion as fact when in fact it is merely opinion. Lets separate Fact from friction. Trust me I've done my homework on this issue.

Also please understand there has been considerable requests to "FILL OUT" the SIN and RIT list. A-NET listens to their customer base. So lets hope ANET grows some balls and gives us a real response for better or worse.

TheMosesPHD · Aug 29, 2006, 12:19 AM // 00:19

3.25 out of 6 still ain't bad at all...

Well I'm done. It seems your little dream bubble is completely impervious to attack.

Though staying active on this thread is great for my post-count, it's becoming a bit monotonous and predictable. I mean, I was just sitting here refreshing from the time Ninna posted waiting for you to come in and say, "the 20 new missions doesn't verify the whole 4th statement" or something to that effect, and what do ya know, you did...

I'd stake my life or any wager at all betting that there will be no new rit/sin skills in Nightfall, but even that wouldn't shake your confidence...

cya.

ducktape · Aug 29, 2006, 12:38 AM // 00:38

Quote:

Originally Posted by TheMosesPHD

If anyone can find the direct quotes from ANet on these official things, it'd be helpful. I know they're official but I can't find the direct quote, and Glory Fox keeps wanting an official statement on the 300 new skills and a bunch of other stuff.

If we could at least get a quote on the 300 new skills then I don't see what other evidence we'd need to prove that there will be no new rit/sin skills in Nightfall.

300 new skills:
75 Paragon + 75 Dervish + 25(6) Core class skills = 300 skills all accounted for.

There's no room for any new rit or sin skills. How is this not enough to prove there will be no new rit/sin skills in Nightfall?

Hmm, I thought that the latest press release said 300 new skills but I read it again and I was wrong. That's what I get for posting while sleepy

It was pointed out by someone in a different thread that if everyone got 5 less skills (70 paragon, 70 dervish, 20x(8) other classes=300) it would work out, and wouldn't be much of a loss for 5 skills each if they sacrificed adding what would otherwise be skill duplicates of Factions or Prophecies skills. Obviously the dervish and paragon would be shorted 5 skills unfairly, but if they made it 310 skills total that would work out just fine. Who knows, since they conveniently left it out of the press release, maybe we're getting 350 skills and it's 75+75+(25x8).

Come to think of it, they have a lot of things they need to provide more information about; PVE preview weekend date, difference between preordering and getting the prerelease pack, number of new areas/quests/missions, number of new skills, what the high-end content is (new FoW/UW?), what exactly "and more" includes for the collector's edition contents...

I think they've been slacking with the information distribution while they were preparing for Leipzig :P

GloryFox · Aug 29, 2006, 12:47 AM // 00:47

Quote:

posted by ducktape
It was pointed out by someone in a different thread that if everyone got 5 less skills (70 paragon, 70 dervish, 20x(8) other classes=300) it would work out, and wouldn't be much of a loss for 5 skills each if they sacrificed adding what would otherwise be skill duplicates of Factions or Prophecies skills. Obviously the dervish and paragon would be shorted 5 skills unfairly, but if they made it 310 skills total that would work out just fine. Who knows, since they conveniently left it out of the press release, maybe we're getting 350 skills and it's 75+75+(25x8).

It was posted on this Thread

http://www.guildwarsguru.com/forum/s...php?t=10010335

blue cheez · Aug 29, 2006, 03:53 AM // 03:53

I really dont mind if there is any new armor for the Sin or Rit, but they BETTER add new skills form them. they are already underdeveloped as it is.

Nexium · Aug 29, 2006, 10:31 AM // 10:31

ppl are living in deny there wont be anymore skills in chapter 3 for Rt ore As
Stand alone Game new story Etc...

Lonesamurai · Aug 29, 2006, 10:43 AM // 10:43

OK, I can see that most of my reading that was a waste of time, however, you CANNOT believe something that you saw at an event as gospel... Like the P/Rt, I doubt its going to be available straight away (except for PvP players with Chapters 2 and 3) if you only have chapter 3...

Good example of something like that is, wait for it... wait... UAX!!! There I said it, UAX, it was offered to us for the beta weekend and then never seen again... just look forward tot he new game, stop your bitching and enjoy it...

If anything, just think how all these new skills are going to affect Titles... There you go, something far more interesting to bitch about

TaiClaw · Aug 29, 2006, 12:36 PM // 12:36

I truely think there has to be some form of content for Assasins and Ritualists. If not, why let them even travel there?

Sure you can market it as a stand alone game, but deep down its just another expansion on Prophecies. I could understand there being 0 content for Ass's and Rits in Prophecies , because these proffesions were not concieved at the time. Yet now Anet has to expand once again on both previous titles, knowing that people WILL take there assasins and rits there. Not just because the option is there.

Although i'm not talking content as in Skills, im talking content as in weapons/armour.

To summarize, if there is going to be 0 content for Ass's and Rits in Nightfall, disable the option to travel there, because otherwise its just a pointless waste of time.

Lonesamurai · Aug 29, 2006, 12:40 PM // 12:40

Quote:

Originally Posted by TaiClaw

I truely think there has to be some form of content for Assasins and Ritualists. If not, why let them even travel there?

Surely you can market it as a stand alone game, but deep down its just another expansion on Prophecies. I could understand there being 0 content for Ass's and Rits and Prophecies , because these proffesions were not concieved at the time. Yet now Anet has to expand once again on both previous titles, knowing that people WILL take there assasins and rits there. Not just because the option is there.

Although i'm not talking content as in Skills, im talking content as in weapons/armour.

To summarize, if there is going to be 0 content for Ass's and Rits in Nightfall, disable the option to travel there, because otherwise its just a worthless excercise.

and by that logic, its also a useless exercise taking ass' and rit's over to Tyria, why not just put an entrance to FoW and UW somewhere in Cantha instead?

Your point falls on its face completely, as there is nothing for them in Prophecies and even with the new weapon updates, they still didn't add weapons for Ass or Rit anywhere in Tyria

Knightsaber Sith · Aug 29, 2006, 12:41 PM // 12:41

Quote:

Originally Posted by TaiClaw

I truely think there has to be some form of content for Assasins and Ritualists. If not, why let them even travel there?

Why let them travel to Tyria?

Quote:

Originally Posted by Lonesamurai

why not just put an entrance to FoW and UW somewhere in Cantha instead?

There already is access to fow/uw in Cantha from Zin Ku Corridor....

TaiClaw · Aug 29, 2006, 12:45 PM // 12:45

Quote:

Originally Posted by Knightsaber Sith

Why let them travel to Tyria?

Why indeed....

I mean, there called "Unique" Factions proffesions, so why not have them bound to Cantha permenantly.

So yes your right, why let them travel to Tyria, to see the sites?

They could market these as expansions and still offer the exact same game, yet by making them "Stand Alone" the consumer buys it knowing that he does not need the other 2 titles to play. Yet once he realises that he is missing out on 2 huge continents, he goes and buys the previous 2 titles at his leisure.

Call it clever marketing, but it will still be a kick in face for those who bought Factions as a Stand Alone game, and wan't to see there Assasin or Rit progress into Nightfall, only to find that nothing awaits him.

Lonesamurai · Aug 29, 2006, 12:51 PM // 12:51

Quote:

Originally Posted by Knightsaber Sith

There already is access to fow/uw in Cantha from Zin Ku Corridor....

I'd completely forgotten about that... cheers for the reminder

So yeah, even more reason why they shouldn't need to go over there... However A ritualist and an assasin are extremely useful in Tyria, where things aren't set up to combat them and you can roll missions so much quicker because of it... So my ranger assasin with his black moa, Ungues of the Oni and Ironwing Flatbow will finish Prophecies MUCH quicker than my other characters and then I'll send him to carry the good fight in Elona... One day I might give him a holiday, then I'll ressurect my Necro/Ranger

Knightsaber Sith · Aug 29, 2006, 12:52 PM // 12:52

Quote:

Originally Posted by TaiClaw

Why indeed....

I mean, there called "Unique" Factions proffesions, so why not have them bound to Cantha permenantly.

So yes your right, why let them travel to Tyria, to see the sites?

Congratulations on totally avoiding the question and in no way defending your argument. If sins/rits are able to travel to tyria and there's no class specific content for them there, there is no reason to expect there to be class specific content (skills,armor, etc...) for them in Elona just because they're able to travel there. If you feel like actually presenting facts that might uphold your argument, go ahead. And even if there is no specific content for them, there's no reason to disallow them from traveling there. Just accept that all professions can go everywhere but future campaigns will only have profession specific content in their home contintent.

TaiClaw · Aug 29, 2006, 01:01 PM // 13:01

Quote:

Originally Posted by Knightsaber Sith

Congratulations on totally avoiding the question and in no way defending your argument. If sins/rits are able to travel to tyria and there's no class specific content for them there, there is no reason to expect there to be class specific content (skills,armor, etc...) for them in Elona just because they're able to travel there. If you feel like actually presenting facts that might uphold your argument, go ahead.

No, your missing my point, there was no need to go back and add content for assasins and rits in Tyria.

A) Because I don't believe the folks who made prophecies made factions.

B) They had a whole new continent for themselves.

However, Assasins and Ritualists were around to see Nightfall through all of its production stages. Im sure Anet realise a great number of people will be taking there Assasin and Ritualist to Elona regardless of new content or not.

Don't you think it would be a good decision on there part to actually include some things for these players, to keep the player happy and have him feel that his class is still important, and also to keep him buying the next chapter and the next and so on?

Knightsaber Sith · Aug 29, 2006, 01:07 PM // 13:07

Quote:

Originally Posted by TaiClaw

Don't you think it would be a good decision on there part to actually include some things for these players, to keep the player happy and have him feel that his class is still important, and also to keep him buying the next chapter and the next and so on?

It would certainly be nice but it would be nearly impossible. They'd have to make every campaign support ever profession which by campaign 4 would be 12. It's just asking too much for them to create new skill/weapons/armor for every class in every campaign. Only the core professions are supported in all campaigns which is why they are called "core". They are they core archetypes and each campaign will also introduce two flavor classes that are only supported in their home land.

Loviatar · Aug 29, 2006, 04:39 PM // 16:39

Quote:

Originally Posted by TaiClaw

Although i'm not talking content as in Skills, im talking content as in weapons/armour.

To summarize, if there is going to be 0 content for Ass's and Rits in Nightfall, disable the option to travel there, because otherwise its just a pointless waste of time
So yes your right, why let them travel to Tyria, to see the sites?

.

i will be very polite.

this is not your game uber item farmer.

if the main idea of *content* that makes a game worth playing is getting items you need a farming game.

ummm yes.........to see the sights to see how differently the new profession plays against the old enemies, do missions, qests etc

unienaule · Aug 29, 2006, 05:08 PM // 17:08

*cough*Elite Skill Capping for secondaries*cough*